3 Questions with Paris Jackson, Linda Perry About Equality in the Music Industry

Paris Jackson, Linda Perry and Alisha Ballard are working to make waves in the music industry through EqualizeHer, an organization co-founded by Perry and Ballard that operates under the mission to, “Achieve equal representation of women across all aspects of the music industry.”

“We’re very new, but our passion is old,” Perry tells American Songwriter. One of their many efforts includes teaming up with Michael Jackson’s daughter, singer/songwriter Paris Jackson, to record a song that was written and produced by an all-female team, “Hit Your Knees.”

In an extensive interview with American Songwriter, the trio talks about the biggest challenges they’ve faced in the music industry, the time Perry took matters into her own hands in the studio that led to one of her biggest career hits and more. 

American Songwriter: What compelled you to form EqualizeHer?

Linda Perry: The truth is, no matter how we look at it, women are always going to be out of balance in the music business. I don’t think we’re ever going to be equal. I don’t think in my lifetime, it’s ever going to happen. But what we can do is make big efforts to try to do the best that we can to bring awareness.  I’ve spent my whole career slapping girls in the face and going, “Wake up, you need to understand what you’re doing.” I’m a tough guy, I get down and dirty with artists and I try to give them information because when I was in a band, I didn’t get that information. So once I was out of that band and I had several things happen to me, I’m like, “Fuck this shit, I’m gonna fucking change this shit up and that’s never gonna happen to me again.” But I had to be aware and I had to have acknowledgment. I’ve been totally like, rootin’ for the girls and trying to bring information. Alisha and I met, both strong, powerful women that have a really great message to bring to everybody and we have a lot of passion. That’s how EqualizeHer started.

Alisha Ballard: We didn’t really plan EqualizeHer, that wasn’t our plan. I started talking to Linda, especially about some of her experiences in the music industry, and working with artists and so much trauma that girls have dealt with in studio spaces, people taking advantage of that. So as we started having conversations and getting to know each other and Linda shared a lot of that information with me, it became clear we have to do something that’s really focused on this.

Paris Jackson: I’m one of the artists that Linda slaps around (she jokes).

LP: Paris is awesome. She’s got this really great vibe. She tries to downplay her coolness and her ability all the time. That’s why I was slapping her around.

PJ: I feel like [Linda] and I are the type of women that upon meeting us you either get it or you don’t. There is no warming up to us. You either get it or you don’t.

[RELATED: Paris Jackson Turns Brokenness Into Dark Alt-Folk Music On Debut Album, ‘wilted’]

AS: What are some of the challenges or experiences you have faced that have helped shape the mission of equalizer?

LP: Early on in my career when I was in 4 Non Blondes, we were recording this album, I didn’t fucking know what I was doing. I got in a band and we got signed and then when we were in the studio, I was treated like I didn’t know what I was doing. I would constantly question the guitar tone or the drum tone, or my vocal tone, and when I was asking these questions I was met with, “Can’t you just let me do my job? Can’t you be the singer?” 

When we recorded “What’s Up?” it was a terrible version of it that he did. I went to the label, I said, “This sucks, I don’t like this version.” They were like, “Well, too bad. It sounds good to us.” So I stole a roll of tape from the studio that we were at at the time and I took the band to another studio in San Francisco. I don’t fucking know what I’m doing, but I just went in there… and I did it all to my ear. All of a sudden we record the song in three takes. It was awesome. Then the douchebag producers showed up to mix it because mastering was the very next day. So he showed up, we mixed it, and I asked for production credit because I said, “I did this,” and everybody kind of laughed at me and said, “Can you be happy that you saved the band’s song?”

And I’m like, “I get it, I see what’s going on.” I was very lucky because I had that experience and I was able to come out on the other side so I can help in this situation because I am somebody that was put up against the wall and I fought back and I succeeded. I think it’s time for a new woman to come in and that’s what EqualizeHer is trying to do. You don’t have to be a pop star that gets naked, you can be the person who’s in charge of all of it.

PJ: My experiences have all been very similar… I’m the one that’s paying everybody, and still, people I’m paying don’t listen… I think one of the main issues is I treat everybody on my crew like we’re equals, and they take advantage of that. So I’ve been able to learn how to pick the people that work well with the way I do things.

I’ve also had experience with different management where they’re like, “How comfortable are you really exploiting your sexuality on stage?” I’ve been a model for seven years, I’ve gotten naked in front of photographers. I’ve walked the runway, I’ve done all these things, and I’m fine with that. But that can’t be the main thing. The talent and music back it up. The music has to be first and we can back it up with sex and things later. I tell Linda these things and I had actually never seen the emotional reaction from her when I told that story of a manager asking me how comfortable I was basically being a sex doll and she’s like, “You don’t have to do that.” 

It’s outright disrespectful because it’s also insinuating that I was not paying attention when I was five years old on a leather couch in the studio watching masters do what they do. I grew up in this. I may be very green when it comes to actually creating music myself and learning the inner workings of production and things like that. But this is an industry that I grew up in. I have 25 years of experience, I’ve 25 years on some of these managers, but my opinion and my experience and my knowledge on these things don’t mean anything to them. It’s because I am female. I see all the time, it’s usually men that are older than me that have an issue with this. It’s ageist and it’s sexist.

AS: Paris, what was it like working with an all-female team on “Hit Your Knees?” What does this song mean to you?

PJ: The song is a really big part of my personal story and finding the most valuable thing to me in my life. I spent a very long time trying to fill that hole that some of us have with a bunch of other things to get momentary relief, to get some form of satisfaction, and my journey of finding something that makes me feel whole and makes me feel safe. Faith makes me feel like I’m gonna be okay and that’s been the biggest turning point for me as a person as a soul. Finding a connection to something greater than myself is my end all be all. That’s the most important part of my story, it’s my favorite part of my life. That’s what the song means to me.

Photo Credit: Nas Bogado/Courtesy of Rogers & Cowan PMK